Vugtis' Ideas on Tournaments and Ranked Play
Recently, there was a Splinterlands proposal Reintroduction of Leagues to Splinterlands by @inobody. While the draft proposal did not pass, it sparked many interesting discussions and ideas. These were expressed in the comments on the post, which I won't repeat here, and on Discord.
For the record, here are the results of the draft proposal.
Ideas from Vugtis
While @vugtis did not respond on Hive, there was a thoughtful response posted on Discord with several interesting thoughts and ideas. Here is a direct link to his Discord message.
Image created with Chat GPT. Prompt: use the image of Vugtis from this post but have Vugtis in a thinking man pose.
The rest of this post is mostly a copy-paste of Vugtis' Discord message. I've added some formatting and made minor editorial changes to the wording, fixed typos, etc. Again, I recommend reading the Discord message if you want to see the exact response.
Response to Reintroduction of Leagues Proposal
Hi, everyone. Regarding the proposal:
I agree with you guys, there should be a place for people to be competitive and have fun. But ranked is not where it should be. Ranked should be simple, battle, buy more cards , win, until you hit a wall, then repeat until you reach the top (or not).
So, where is this competitive place I am talking about? It should be 'tournament'. The problem is the current tournament format is a complete mess. It doesn't do what it is supposed to do.*
Tournaments are simply a reward-farming place for a select few people. It doesn't reach enough of the player base, due to the way it works. It worked several years ago when Splinterlands started with only a small player base, but not now.
Bad Timing
I [Vugtis] would say this proposal has bad timing. I just told Dave (@davemccoy) maybe a week or 2 weeks ago that I am planning to draft a fairly comprehensive guide on tournament rework.
I have collected ideas for months, and I hope that I can turn them into a detailed and executable plan for the team, not just a random idea. I am not sure how long it will take, or if it will ever finish to the quality that I am hoping for. My initial plan is roughly 1 month, but it depends on my workload. Remember, I am not a team member, I have other things I need to take care of. But I personally think that is way better than changing the current ranked format. So, it's not about me hating leagues, it is never how I felt, but to me, ranked is not the best place for a highly competitive environment.
Tournaments and Events
I'll give you guys a rough idea of what I am currently trying to draft. Remember, this is my personal idea.
- Tournaments will be renamed to 'event.'
- The current tournament format will be something that is held every once in a while. For example quarterly, and/or annually. This essentially makes tournaments a real tournament, and possibly more fit in the e-sport category.
- Events will consist of a different game mode, with a different time frame, for example, seasonal, 3 days, or one off.
- The events game mode will try to give utility to all card editions.
- There will be bracket/grouping system (e.g. a group of 8, 20, etc) with leagues, meaning there is a winner per bracket for a game mode. This allows multiple winners per bracket as opposed the current tournament format which only allows a small number of winners.
This is the big overview of what I am trying to do, there are other mechanics involved so all of these make more sense in terms of reaching out to a larger player base, scalable, utilizing our current assets, including the older ones.
So, with this thought, I have to vote AGAINST the proposal. I think there are better solutions. With that said, feel free to vote however you guys want.
End of Vugtis' Comments
That is the end of the comments from Vugtis on the Discord message.
Personally, I love the idea of adding events as outlined above. I also wish we would bring leagues back in some form or fashion. I'm sure this will get more traction eventually and I wanted to draw more attention to the topic.
What do you think about the idea of modifying how tournaments are handled and adding events?
Bonus Image of Vugtis
As a bonus, here is another image I generated of Vugtis with Chat GPT. I don't like it as much as the previous image but wanted to include it anyway.
Image generated with Chat GPT 4o. Prompt: Make an image of an ultra-wealthy and powerful character inspired by the username 'vugtis'. The figure is dressed in an extravagant, futuristic suit adorned with gold, platinum, and diamond-encrusted details, radiating unmatched opulence. They sit in the thinking man pose in a lavish penthouse atop a towering skyscraper, surrounded by high-tech luxury—gold-trimmed furniture, holographic stock market displays, rare art pieces, and piles of cash and digital wealth symbols floating around them. Include the SPS token symbol from Splinterlands. A futuristic city with neon lights and flying cars spreads below through massive floor-to-ceiling windows. Their expression is one of absolute confidence, exuding dominance and supreme success.
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STOP
But is it about competitive play in ranked ?, or simply about enjoying a game and having fun ? One could argue that they are both one and the same thing, but I would hold that this is only partly true.
Winning is fun, that is indeed competitive by definition, but just because I like winning a match , it may not mean that I'd enjoy pitting myself against the best brains and decks, where my Mr. Average self would definitely not fare well.
The league re-work was about bringing fun back into deck building, learning a playstyle that suits your budget and not needing to spend big (very big) every set release to stay in the arena that you study, learn and practice.
That is the difference for me.
Yes, I agree, give the competitive achievers an arena to display their skills, so , yes re-work tournaments, but please, please, give me a place to craft a Sliver deck, hone my playstyle and get used to the nuances of the abilities in that level , without needing to aim for max cards every time.
For example, my CA summoners are at Silver level, I can't afford to get them higher, event though I have many of the cheaper cards at higher levels and some at max. Those Silver summoners never get played, except in brawls occasionally where I play Silver, but given that it's Silver Wild, they still sit idle.
So, I agree and I disagree and feel that a rework of leagues/ranked was not to the exclusion of a rework of Tournaments.
Some form of sensible progression ladder is badly needed. Look how popular Foundation League is now. I think that is partly because it is the nearest we have to a truly level playing field with regards to the teams you will likely face.
The simple solution is to allow a player to select ANY league at the start of the season and you remain locked into that league for the remainder of the season. Want to play in Gold with your mix of Bronze and silver cards ..go for it, test your skill and creative deck building. Want to play in Silver with your mix of Silver, Gold and Diamond cards...fine, but your cards will be capped at Silver level for that season.
One further point...how many edition cycles can we keep pushing a player to buy max cards...I've seen three editions now, I started just before Chaos Legion was released, I've pushed to build out my deck, each time I've spent a few grand on packs and singles to get my deck playable, and I love the game, but really, now reality has to set in at some point , that level of spending is really too much, I'm not a rich man by any means,(just old with few expenses ), and I'm wondering if I can really justify a few thousand again next year. I don't think I can.
Let me play in Silver, and if I feel inclined push higher , I like Gold too. I will build up eventually. As it stands, it really is a go hard or go home playstyle.
BTW..I LOVE Foundation
I love foundation also!
This seems like the most obvious solution to me. Several people have mentioned this and it appears to address the concerns on both sides of the discussion.
Man, Vugtis looks fancy. And here I am being just a cat. 😅
A brave cat!
I did one of you in a post awhile back and it came out like this 😂
Fundamentally, I feel like I always agreed with this logic that ranked isn’t the place for competitive play and it was in fact tournaments. I do also want to see a rework of tournaments including extending the length of a tournament and not cutting people out. For example you have a 7 day tournament and have the daily pools on being 5-6 other players so your daily commitment is lighter than currently but then every day the new pools would group up like ratings so then the bottom performing players still have games all week with similar ranked opponents throughout. This is the closest I think we could get to Swiss pairings.
Not sure how I feel about ranked being the place for competitive play or not. Perhaps we could do like some of the modern games do now and have a standard play and ranked/league play. Call of Duty and Fortnite do that, probably many others. Of course we'd need a LOT more players before diluting the playerbase and splitting leagues further.
Getting people to compete in one event for 5 days is asking a lot, especially when by day 3 those in the lower pools have no chance of winning the tournament
A tournament rework is really needed, but I think we need to look closely at live tournaments @keeegs has the right idea, different levels of live tournaments from the casual/competitive weekly tournaments (FNM in magic) to monthly larger events and seasonal championships
Live tournaments would be cool. Might be tough with so many different time zones playing at the same time.
Watching the live tournaments at Splinterfest was so exciting.
Yes. It’s a difficult one but other games manage it, there must be a way to do it, we may have to start with the majority rule on monthly/quarterly events but for the “Friday night magic” style weekly events you could run one every 4 hours (limit entry to one per week) on a particular day to give everyone a nice casual tournament to enter
True, but other games that manage it may have a larger player base. It could work if we get a larger player base, but I wonder if we could get enough participation if we split up time zones right now. Maybe in the future?
Agreed, but things need to be in place before people arrive if we want to grow that side of the game.
Also true.